Bayes for Schizophrenics: Reasoning in Delusional Disorders

Related to: The Apologist and the Revolutionary, Dreams with Damaged Priors

Several years ago, I posted about V.S. Ramachandran's 1996 theory explaining anosognosia through an "apologist" and a "revolutionary".

Anosognosia, a condition in which extremely sick patients mysteriously deny their sickness, occurs during right-sided brain injury but not left-sided brain injury. It can be extraordinarily strange: for example, in one case, a woman whose left arm was paralyzed insisted she could move her left arm just fine, and when her doctor pointed out her immobile arm, she claimed that was her daughter's arm even though it was obviously attached to her own shoulder. Anosognosia can be temporarily alleviated by squirting cold water into the patient's left ear canal, after which the patient suddenly realizes her condition but later loses awareness again and reverts back to the bizarre excuses and confabulations.

Ramachandran suggested that the left brain is an "apologist", trying to justify existing theories, and the right brain is a "revolutionary" which changes existing theories when conditions warrant. If the right brain is damaged, patients are unable to change their beliefs; so when a patient's arm works fine until a right-brain stroke, the patient cannot discard the hypothesis that their arm is functional, and can only use the left brain to try to fit the facts to their belief.

In the almost twenty years since Ramachandran's theory was published, new research has kept some of the general outline while changing many of the specifics in the hopes of explaining a wider range of delusions in neurological and psychiatric patients. The newer model acknowledges the left-brain/right-brain divide, but adds some new twists based on the Mind Projection Fallacy and the brain as a Bayesian reasoner.


INTRODUCTION TO DELUSIONS

Strange as anosognosia is, it's only one of several types of delusions, which are broadly categorized into polythematic and monothematic. Patients with polythematic delusions have multiple unconnected odd ideas: for example, the famous schizophrenic game theorist John Nash believed that he was defending the Earth from alien attack, that he was the Emperor of Antarctica, and that he was the left foot of God. A patient with a monothematic delusion, on the other hand, usually only has one odd idea. Monothematic delusions vary less than polythematic ones: there are a few that are relatively common across multiple patients. For example:

In the Capgras delusion, the patient, usually a victim of brain injury but sometimes a schizophrenic, believes that one or more people close to her has been replaced by an identical imposter. For example, one male patient expressed the worry that his wife was actually someone else, who had somehow contrived to exactly copy his wife's appearance and mannerisms. This delusion sounds harmlessly hilarious, but it can get very ugly: in at least one case, a patient got so upset with the deceit that he murdered the hypothesized imposter - actually his wife.

The Fregoli delusion is the opposite: here the patient thinks that random strangers she meets are actually her friends and family members in disguise. Sometimes everyone may be the same person, who must be as masterful at quickly changing costumes as the famous Italian actor Fregoli (inspiring the condition's name).

In the Cotard delusion, the patient believes she is dead. Cotard patients will neglect personal hygiene, social relationships, and planning for the future - as the dead have no need to worry about such things. Occasionally they will be able to describe in detail the "decomposition" they believe they are undergoing.

Patients with all these types of delusions1 - as well as anosognosiacs - share a common feature: they usually have damage to the right frontal lobe of the brain (including in schizophrenia, where the brain damage is of unknown origin and usually generalized, but where it is still possible to analyze which areas are the most abnormal). It would be nice if a theory of anosognosia also offered us a place to start explaining these other conditions, but this Ramachandran's idea fails to do. He posits a problem with belief shift: going from the originally correct but now obsolete "my arm is healthy" to the updated "my arm is paralyzed". But these other delusions cannot be explained by simple failure to update: delusions like "the person who appears to be my wife is an identical imposter" never made sense. We will have to look harder.

ABNORMAL PERCEPTION: THE FIRST FACTOR

Coltheart, Langdon, and McKay posit what they call the "two-factor theory" of delusion. In the two-factor theory, one problem causes an abnormal perception, and a second problem causes the brain to come up with a bizarre instead of a reasonable explanation.

Abnormal perception has been best studied in the Capgras delusion. A series of experiments, including some by Ramachandran himself, demonstrate that Capgras patients lack a skin conductance response (usually used as a proxy of emotional reaction) to familiar faces. This meshes nicely with the brain damage pattern in Capgras, which seems to involve the connection between the face recognition areas in the temporal lobe and the emotional areas in the limibic system. So although the patient can recognize faces, and can feel emotions, the patient cannot feel emotions related to recognizing faces.

The older "one-factor" theories of delusion stopped here. The patient, they said, knows that his wife looks like his wife, but he doesn't feel any emotional reaction to her. If it was really his wife, he would feel something - love, irritation, whatever - but he feels only the same blankness that would accompany seeing a stranger. Therefore (the one-factor theory says) his brain gropes for an explanation and decides that she really is a stranger. Why does this stranger look like his wife? Well, she must be wearing a very good disguise.

One-factor theories also do a pretty good job of explaining many of the remaining monothematic delusions. A 1998 experiment shows that Cotard delusion sufferers have a globally decreased autonomic response: that is, nothing really makes them feel much of anything - a state consistent with being dead. And anosognosiacs have lost not only the nerve connections that would allow them to move their limbs, but the nerve connections that would send distress signals and even the connections that would send back "error messages" if the limb failed to move correctly - so the brain gets data that everything is fine.

The basic principle behind the first factor is "Assume that reality is such that my mental states are justified", a sort of Super Mind Projection Fallacy.

Although I have yet to find an official paper that says so, I think this same principle also explains many of the more typical schizophrenic delusions, of which two of the most common are delusions of grandeur and delusions of persecution. Delusions of grandeur are the belief that one is extremely important. In pop culture, they are typified by the psychiatric patient who believes he is Jesus or Napoleon - I've never met any Napoleons, but I know several Jesuses and recently worked with a man who thought he was Jesus and John Lennon at the same time. Here the first factor is probably an elevated mood (working through a miscalibrated sociometer). "Wow, I feel like I'm really awesome. In what case would I be justified in thinking so highly of myself? Only if I were Jesus and John Lennon at the same time!" A similar mechanism explains delusions of persecution, the classic "the CIA is after me" form of disease. We apply the Super Mind Projection Fallacy to a garden-variety anxiety disorder: "In what case would I be justified in feeling this anxious? Only if people were constantly watching me and plotting to kill me. Who could do that? The CIA."

But despite the explanatory power of the Super Mind Projection Fallacy, the one-factor model isn't enough.

ABNORMAL BELIEF EVALUATION: THE SECOND FACTOR

The one-factor model requires people to be really stupid. Many Capgras patients were normal intelligent people before their injuries. Surely they wouldn't leap straight from "I don't feel affection when I see my wife's face" to "And therefore this is a stranger who has managed to look exactly like my wife, sounds exactly like my wife, owns my wife's clothes and wedding ring and so on, and knows enough of my wife's secrets to answer any question I put to her exactly like my wife would." The lack of affection vaguely supports the stranger hypothesis, but the prior for the stranger hypothesis is so low that it should never even enter consideration (remember this phrasing: it will become important later.) Likewise, we've all felt really awesome at one point or another, but it's never occurred to most of us that maybe we are simultaneously Jesus and John Lennon.

Further, most psychiatric patients with the deficits involved don't develop delusions. People with damage to the ventromedial area suffer the same disconnection between face recognition and emotional processing as Capgras patients, but they don't draw any unreasonable conclusions from it. Most people who get paralyzed don't come down with anosognosia, and most people with mania or anxiety don't think they're Jesus or persecuted by the CIA. What's the difference between these people and the delusional patients?

The difference is the right dorsolateral prefrontal cortex, an area of the brain strongly associated with delusions. If whatever brain damage broke your emotional reactions to faces or paralyzed you or whatever spared the RDPC, you are unlikely to develop delusions. If your brain damage also damaged this area, you are correspondingly more likely to come up with a weird explanation.

In his first papers on the subject, Coltheart vaguely refers to the RDPC as a "belief evaluation" center. Later, he gets more specific and talks about its role in Bayesian updating. In his chronology, a person damages the connection between face recognition and emotion, and "rationally" concludes the Capgras hypothesis. In his model, even if there's only a 1% prior of your spouse being an imposter, if there's a 1000 times greater likelihood of you not feeling anything toward an imposter than to your real spouse, you can "rationally" come to believe in the delusion. In normal people, this rational belief then gets worn away by updating based on evidence: the imposter seems to know your spouse's personal details, her secrets, her email passwords. In most patients, this is sufficient to have them update back to the idea that it is really their spouse. In Capgras patients, the damage to the RDPC prevents updating on "exogenous evidence" (for some reason, the endogenous evidence of the lack of emotion itself still gets through) and so they maintain their delusion.

This theory has some trouble explaining why patients are still able to update about other situations, but Coltheart speculates that maybe the belief evaluation system is weakened but not totally broken, and can deal with anything except the ceaseless stream of contradictory endogenous information.

EXPLANATORY ADEQUACY BIAS

McKay makes an excellent critique of several questionable assumptions of this theory.

First, is the Capgras hypothesis ever plausible? Coltheart et al pretend that the prior is 1/100, but this implies that there is a base rate of your spouse being an imposter one out of every hundred times you see her (or perhaps one out of every hundred people has a fake spouse) either of which is preposterous. No reasonable person could entertain the Capgras hypothesis even for a second, let alone for long enough that it becomes their working hypothesis and develops immunity to further updating from the broken RDPC.

Second, there's no evidence that the ventromedial patients - the ones who lose face-related emotions but don't develop the Capgras delusion - once had the Capgras delusion but then successfully updated their way out of it. They just never develop the delusion to begin with.

McKay keeps the Bayesian model, but for him the second factor is not a deficit in updating in general, but a deficit in the use of priors. He lists two important criteria for reasonable belief: "explanatory adequacy" (what standard Bayesians call the likelihood ratio; the new data must be more likely if the new belief is true than if it is false) and "doxastic conservativism" (what standard Bayesians call the prior; the new belief must be reasonably likely to begin with given everything else the patient knows about the world).

Delusional patients with damage to their RDPC lose their ability to work with priors and so abandon all doxastic conservativism, essentially falling into a what we might term the Super Base Rate Fallacy. For them the only important criterion for a belief is explanatory adequacy. So when they notice their spouse's face no longer elicits any emotion, they decide that their spouse is not really their spouse at all. This does a great job of explaining the observed data - maybe the best job it's possible for an explanation to do. Its only minor problem is that it has a stupendously low prior, and this doesn't matter because they are no longer able to take priors into account.

This also explains why the delusional belief is impervious to new evidence. Suppose the patient's spouse tells personal details of their honeymoon that no one else could possibly know. There are several possible explanations: the patient's spouse really is the patient's spouse, or (says the left-brain Apologist) the patient's spouse is an alien who was able to telepathically extract the relevant details from the patient's mind. The telepathic alien imposter hypothesis has great explanatory adequacy: it explains why the person looks like the spouse (the alien is a very good imposter), why the spouse produces no emotional response (it's not the spouse at all) and why the spouse knows the details of the honeymoon (the alien is telepathic). The "it's really your spouse" explanation only explains the first and the third observations. Of course, we as sane people know that the telepathic alien hypothesis has a very low base rate plausibility because of its high complexity and violation of Occam's Razor, but these are exactly the factors that the RDPC-damaged2 patient can't take into account. Therefore, the seemingly convincing new evidence of the spouse's apparent memories only suffices to help the delusional patient infer that the imposter is telepathic.

The Super Base Rate Fallacy can explain the other delusional states as well. I recently met a patient who was, indeed, convinced the CIA were after her; of note she also had extreme anxiety to the point where her arms were constantly shaking and she was hiding under the covers of her bed. CIA pursuit is probably the best possible reason to be anxious; the only reason we don't use it more often is how few people are really pursued by the CIA (well, as far as we know). My mentor warned me not to try to argue with the patient or convince her that the CIA wasn't really after her, as (she said from long experience) it would just make her think I was in on the conspiracy. This makes sense. "The CIA is after you and your doctor is in on it" explains both anxiety and the doctor's denial of the CIA very well; "The CIA is not after you" explains only the doctor's denial of the CIA. For anyone with a pathological inability to handle Occam's Razor, the best solution to a challenge to your hypothesis is always to make your hypothesis more elaborate.

OPEN QUESTIONS


Although I think McKay's model is a serious improvement over its predecessors, there are a few loose ends that continue to bother me.

"You have brain damage" is also a theory with perfect explanatory adequacy. If one were to explain the Capgras delusion to Capgras patients, it would provide just as good an explanation for their odd reactions as the imposter hypothesis. Although the patient might not be able to appreciate its decreased complexity, they should at least remain indifferent between the two hypotheses. I've never read of any formal study of this, but given that someone must have tried explaining the Capgras delusion to Capgras patients I'm going to assume it doesn't work. Why not?

Likewise, how come delusions are so specific? It's impossible to convince someone who thinks he is Napoleon that he's really just a random non-famous mental patient, but it's also impossible to convince him he's Alexander the Great (at least I think so; I don't know if it's ever been tried). But him being Alexander the Great is also consistent with his observed data and his deranged inference abilities. Why decide it's the CIA who's after you, and not the KGB or Bavarian Illuminati?

Why is the failure so often limited to failed inference from mental states? That is, if a Capgras patient sees it is raining outside, the same process of base rate avoidance that made her fall for the Capgras delusion ought to make her think she's been transported to ther rainforest or something. This happens in polythematic delusion patients, where anything at all can generate a new delusion, but not those with monothematic delusions like Capgras. There must be some fundamental difference between how one draws inferences from mental states versus everything else.

This work also raises the question of whether one can one consciously use System II Bayesian reasoning to argue oneself out of a delusion. It seems improbable, but I recently heard about an n=1 personal experiment of a rationalist with schizophrenia who used successfully used Bayes to convince themselves that a delusion (or possibly hallucination; the story was unclear) was false. I don't have their permission to post their story here, but I hope they'll appear in the comments.

FOOTNOTES


1: I left out discussion of the Alien Hand Syndrome, even though it was in my sources, because I believe it's more complicated than a simple delusion. There's some evidence that the alien hand actually does move independently; for example it will sometimes attempt to thwart tasks that the patient performs voluntarily with their good hand. Some sort of "split brain" issues seem like a better explanation than simple Mind Projection.

2: The right dorsolateral prefrontal cortex also shows up in dream research, where it tends to be one of the parts of the brain shut down during dreaming. This provides a reasonable explanation of why we don't notice our dreams' implausibility while we're dreaming them - and Eliezer specifically mentions he can't use priors correctly in his dreams. It also highlights some interesting parallels between dreams and the monothematic delusions. For example, the typical "And then I saw my mother, but she was also somehow my fourth grade teacher at the same time" effect seems sort of like Capgras and Fregoli. Even more interestingly, the RDPC gets switched on during lucid dreaming, providing an explanation of why lucid dreamers are able to reason normally in dreams. Because lucid dreaming also involves a sudden "switching on" of "awareness", this makes the RDPC a good target area for consciousness research.

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Reminded me of The Three Christs of Ypsilanti:

To study the basis for delusional belief systems, [psychologist] Rokeach brought together three men who each claimed to be Jesus Christ and confronted them with one another's conflicting claims, while encouraging them to interact personally as a support group. Rokeach also attempted to manipulate other aspects of their delusions by inventing messages from imaginary characters. He did not, as he had hoped, provoke any lessening of the patients' delusions, but did document a number of changes in their beliefs.

While initially the three patients quarreled over who was holier and reached the point of physical altercation, they eventually each explained away the other two as being mental patients in a hospital, or dead and being operated by machines.

Where are we on selectively/temporarily/safely de-activating brain regions? Magnetic field to the RDPC sounds like it'd be fantastically fun at partiesextremely informative under the right circumstances.

Note to self: Do not attend any party organized by MBlume without making sure that all participants have signed an iron-clad NDA in advance.

Don't worry, what happens in la la land stays in la la land.

Note to self: Always sign NDAs associated to parties thrown by MBlume.

I had the exact same thought myself back in 2008, so I asked an experimental psych professor about this. At the same, he said that the TMS devices that we had are somewhat wide-area and also induce considerable muscle activation. This doesn't matter very much when studying the occipital lobe, but for the prefrontal cortex you basically start scrunching up the person's face, which is fairly distracting. Maybe worth trying anyway.

I've wanted to get my hands on a TMS device for years. Building one at home does not seem particularly feasible, and the magnetism involved is probably dangerous for nearby metal/electronics...

Building one at home does not seem particularly feasible, and the magnetism involved is probably dangerous for nearby metal/electronics...

A few minutes on Google makes this seem very unlikely.

I'm scared as hell to induce currents in my brain without knowing the neurobiology of it, but I do understand the electrical engineering half, so if you want an electromagnet and driver, I'll help you build one.

Would a neurologist who has thus far been immersed daily with the fact that all brains can fail in all sorts of interesting ways be hit just as bad with these delusions if given brain damage as someone who might have operated all their life under a sort of naive realism that makes no difference between reality and their brain's picture of it? What about a philosopher with no neurological experience but with a well-seated obsession with the map not being the territory?

Had to make an account to answer this one, since I can give unique insight

I'm an atypical case in that I had the Capgras Delusion (along with Reduplicative Paramnesia) in childhood, rather than as an adult. The delusions started sometime around 6-9 years of age. I hid it from others, partly because I halfway knew it was ridiculous, partly because I didn't want to let out that I was on to them...and it caused me quite a bit of anxiety, because I felt like I lost my loved ones and slipped into parallel universes every few days. I would try to keep my eyes on my loved ones, because as soon as I looked away and looked back the feeling that something was different would return.

Sometime around 12-14, I realized how implausible it was for any kind of impostor to conduct such large scale conspiracy, and how implausible it was that I was slipping into parallel universe. I told my parents what I was experiencing and admitted it was irrational. I forced myself to ignore the feeling every time it came (though it still bothered me). Eventually around 17 the feeling stopped bothering me altogether, although little twinges still occured from time to time.

I'm currently in what I would consider to be above average mental health, and many years later learned I the name of the delusions that had plagued me as a child. Prior to identifying them as monothematic delusions, I had thought that imposters and parallel universes might simply be a gifted child's equivalent of monsters under the bed. My parents thought it was from reading/watching too much fiction. I never suspected a neurological disorder until years later.

I'm not sure if I was able to see past the delusion because I'm an atypical case (no known brain injury), because I was a child, because my brain healed via biological mechanism, or because I'm intelligent...but I can tell you that my memory of the event involves me figuring out that the delusion was improbable and consciously working to bring it to an end.

So unless my memories are false (it was a long time ago) or I am engaging in mis-attribution, the answer to your question is that yes, in some cases it would be possible for someone to use rational thinking to overcome this kind of disorder.

This is yet again a different scenario, but very interesting, thanks! It does occur to me now that there might be adult trauma patients who can see through the delusion, and never get diagnosed with it, since they don't start raving about impostor family members but just go, whoa, brain seems messed, better go see the stroke doctor.

Jill Bolte has provided a case study. She is a neurologist who had a stroke. Her experience is recounted in her TED talk and her book.

I have read the book (I recently received it from an elderly friend who hoarded books--I picked through about $20,000 worth of books and chose several hundred dollars worth), and it started off interesting, to hear of her personal experience of the stroke and its accompanying mind-states. She seems to have fought her way through various delusions, but not with any more success than other examples cited here. Yes, she is/was a neuroscientist. She also proudly proclaims that she tells her bowels "Good job! I am so thankful that you do exactly what you are meant to do!" every time she takes a dump, and concluded the book with some painfully New Age-y exhortations which gave me the same urge to roll around frothing at the mouth that I often experienced with clearly delusional Christian preachers in church.

All of the theories presented in this post seem to make the implausible assumption that somehow the brain acts like a hypothetical ideally rational individual and that impairment somehow breaks some aspect of this rationality.

However, there is a great deal of evidence the brain works nothing like this. In contrast, it has many specific modules that are responsible for certain kinds of thought or behavior. These modules are not weighed by some rational actor that sifts through them, they are the brain. When these modules come into conflict, e.g., in the standard word/color test where yellow is spelled in red, fairly simply conflict resolution methods are brought into play. When things go wrong in the brain, either an impairment in conflict resolution mechanisms or in the underlying modules themselves, things will go wonky in specific (not general) ways.

Speaking from personal experience, being in a psychotic/paranoid state simply makes certain things seem super salient to you. You can be quite well aware of the rational arguments against the conclusion you are worrying about but it's just so salient that it 'wins.' In other words it also feels like there is just a failure in your ability to override certain misbehaving brain processes rather than some general inability to update appropriately. This is further supported by the fact that skizophrenics and others with delusions seem to be able to update largely appropriately in certain aspects, e.g., what answer is expected on a test, while still maintaining their delusional state.

This is generally a good comment, but I think the views of the original post and your comment are actually pretty similar. For example, seeing the brain as a rational Bayesian agent is compatible with the modular view. One module might store beliefs, another might be responsible for forming new candidate beliefs on the basis of sensory input, another module may enforce consistency and weaken beliefs which don't fit in... The "rational actor that sifts through [the modules]" could easily be embodied by one or several of the modules themselves. Whether this is a good model is a more complicated question (it certainly isn't perfect since we know people diverge from the Bayesian ideal quite regularly), but it is not implausible.

It is embarrassing to admit but I used to think I really had dog ears and a tail until I was about 16.

Well, at least older students found it completely adorable when I made noises...and the school authorities thought I was like smart or something and didn't really care either.

I don't really know the cause, I don't remember knowing about kemonomimi until a bit later but I had delusions not only about seeing these body parts in myself but also felt them. I thought I broke my tail once, for example.

A similar mechanism explains delusions of persecution, the classic "the CIA is after me" form of disease. We apply the Super Mind Projection Fallacy to a garden-variety anxiety disorder: "In what case would I be justified in feeling this anxious? Only if people were constantly watching me and plotting to kill me. Who could do that? The CIA."

My mom (a psychiatrist) was listening to a continuing education program on schizophrenia, and the lecturer said that schizophrenia tends to develop slowly, and in stages; before a person ends up with delusions of persecution, they usually start out by feeling intense fear and anxiety that they can't come up with any explanations for.

I've never read of any formal study of this, but given that someone must have tried explaining the Capgras delusion to Capgras patients I'm going to assume it doesn't work. Why not?

Off the top of my head, that people believe what their brain tells them above any outside evidence, c.f. religious conversion originating from what, to the outside view, is clearly a personal delusion - but, from the inside view, is incontrovertible evidence of God.

It takes very good and clear thinking for the lens to actually see its flaws even when you don't have brain damage to the bit that evaluates evidence. I'm somewhat surprised a rationalist with schizophrenia actually managed this. Though TheOtherDave has mentioned being able to work out that a weird perception was almost certainly due to the stroke he was recovering from, and Eliezer mentions someone else managing it as well.

John Nash claimed that he recovered from schizophrenia because "he decided to think rationally" - but this only happened after he took medications, so...

This provides a reasonable explanation of why we don't notice our dreams' implausibility while we're dreaming them - and Eliezer specifically mentions he can't use priors correctly in his dreams.

Have I ever mentioned my theory that it may be partially due to overloaded working memory?

"You have brain damage" is also a theory with perfect explanatory adequacy. If one were to explain the Capgras delusion to Capgras patients, it would provide just as good an explanation for their odd reactions as the imposter hypothesis. Although the patient might not be able to appreciate its decreased complexity, they should at least remain indifferent between the two hypotheses. I've never read of any formal study of this, but given that someone must have tried explaining the Capgras delusion to Capgras patients I'm going to assume it doesn't work. Why not?

Maybe it's really hard to really get that you are a brain on an intuitive level. Human intuitions seem to be pretty dualistic (well, at least mine do). So 'you have brain damage' doesn't sound very explanatory unless you've spent lot of time convincing yourself that it should.

By the way, the last link is broken.

Yvain, it seems like some of this is potentially answered by how this interacts with other cognitive biases present.

Re: specific delusions, when you have an entire class of equally-explanatory hypotheses, how do you choose between them? The availability heuristic! These hypotheses do have to come from somewhere inside the neural network after all. You could argue that availability is a form of "priors", but these "priors" are formed on the level of neurons themselves and not a specific brain region: some connection strengths are stronger than others.

I would not wish brain damage on anyone, but should one of us have that unfortunate circumstance befall us I would be extremely inclined to go talk to them. I am so damn curious what this feels like from the inside! I am somewhat embarrassed to admit that the thought of having to build completely new neural connections to get around existing damage sounds like an insanely interesting challenge...

I also wonder about reasoning our way out of delusional states. The closest parallel that most people have access to would be the use of various psychoactives. I have heard multiple reports of people who have reasoned their way out of delusional conclusions on cannabinoid agonists and 5-HT2A agonists (and dopamine agonists, with lesser evidence).

The most difficult challenge would appear to be kappa opioid agonism, a dissociative state induced by the federally-legal herb salvia divinorum. Most users report being unaware they ingested a substance at all, no awareness of having a body, and no concept of self-identity, coincident with extreme perceptual distortions. I am no longer clear what Bayesian reasoning would even look like for some points in mindspace.

Edit: I thought of another relevant state: delirium induced by anticholinergics. Unlike 5-HT2A agonists where people do not confuse perceptual distortions for reality, in delirious states people do routinely believe that what they are perceiving is actually occurring. Unfortunately these states are widely regarded as unpleasant, and no rationalist I know personally has experimented with sufficiently large doses of anticholinergics.

It seems improbable, but I recently heard about an n=1 personal experiment of a rationalist with schizophrenia who used successfully used Bayes to convince themselves that a delusion (or possibly hallucination; the story was unclear) was false. I don't have their permission to post their story here, but I hope they'll appear in the comments.

I was under the impression that learning to recognize hallucinations was a standard component of schizophrenia therapy.

For what it's worth, the "Super Base Rate Fallacy" seems to line up with my own experiences, except that there's sometimes an independent part of my mind that can go "Okay, I have 99.999% confidence that the floor will eat us. But what's the actual odds of that confidence, and what evidence did I use to reach it?". While I can't just dismiss the absurd confidence value as absurd, I can still (sometimes) do a meta-evaluation about the precise confidence.

It's sort of like how if a friend says that global warming is 99.99% likely to be true, I can't simply rewrite my friend to have 50% confidence. But I can question the evidence and see how he reached his conclusion, and if it's just "oh, I read a newspaper article that said it was real", my actual confidence will be vastly lower.

I only recently figured out this trick (and suspect LessWrong probably helped me develop it), so I couldn't say why it sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. I can say it's much harder to ignore paranoia about people, and much easier to ignore anything that would be easily objectively checked ("the floor will eat me", step on to floor, "the floor failed to eat me. Falsified!")

For example, one male patient expressed the worry that his wife was actually someone else, who had somehow contrived to exactly copy his wife's appearance and mannerisms. This delusion sounds harmlessly hilarious ...

It's harmless to claim that someone is observationally equivalent to his wife, but not his wife? When that kind of thing happens on a large scale, it's called "the debate about p-zombies".

isn't claimed actual equivalence the problem with P-zombies. Someone being observationally equivalent but different is merely extremely unlikely (maybe she has an identical twin, maybe aliens etc.) P-zombies are supposed to be indistingishable in principle, which is impossible/requires souls that aren't subject to testing for distinguishability.

I wonder if the same mechanisms could be invovled in conspiracy theorists. Their way of thinking seems very similar. I also suspect a reinforcement mechanism: it becomes more and more difficult for the subject to deny his own beliefs, as it would require abandonning large parts of his present (and coherent) belief system, leaving him with almost nothing left.

This could explain why patients are reluctant to accept alternative versions afterwards (such as "you have a brain damage").

"Coltheart et al pretend that the prior is 1/100, but this implies that there is a base rate of your spouse being an imposter one out of every hundred times you see her (or perhaps one out of every hundred people has a fake spouse) either of which is preposterous."

What if their prior on not feeling anything upon seeing their wife is 0? What if most of the reason for reasonable people's prior on this being much lower it is low status, instrumentally bad, etc, but their rational sincere thinking about it prior is close to 50/50? I notice you called the idea preposterous and something reasonable people wouldn't take seriously which are both quite status-ey. So if their aversion to instrumentally bad ideas and/or their aversion to ideas people will think them crazy for gets switched off they can easily get the wrong answer. Perhaps a fear of being of being fooled, or a fight or flight paranoia spiral could be what makes them think so.

I have no idea if any of that is true.

Similarly, I think Coltheart's criticism described here was flawed because it made the prior too specific. How often do you see a person at a distance or facing away and you "recognize" them as a loved one, but then the person comes closer or turns around and you realize you were wrong? It's not often, but it happens enough that we all know that feeling of sudden non-recognition. I often see it in children who come up to me expecting to find their father. The likelihood ratio of priors doesn't have to be for "my wife" versus "an imposter", but could be for "my wife" versus "not my wife". If that is the case, then the brain-damaged person uses the imposter theory to explain the general "not my wife" endogenous evidence.